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| 00:53:47 | mass | I rather would like to go to rubyconf, but I have no idea where/when/how to sign up |
| 00:54:01 | mass | rubyconf.org still gives info about the upcoming 2007 :P |
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| 01:18:23 | zenspider | mass: where is florida at some resort hotel thingy. when is oct or nov. how is when they announce it |
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| 05:06:58 | headius | hey, question for y'all |
| 05:07:35 | headius | have you considered finding some way to hide methods on rubinius classes that are above and beyond what should be there for spec, or have you decided not to bother? |
| 05:08:14 | headius | still seems to me like that's going to be a source of grief in the future, where someone might write something on rubinius and it wouldn't work elsewhere |
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| 09:36:30 | rue | Morning |
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| 10:52:53 | dbussink | rue: how is your knowledge on obscure ruby bugs? :P |
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| 11:25:06 | joachimm | who is hosting http://donttreadonme.co.uk/rubinius-irc/rubinius.log.html ? it seems to be down |
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| 11:46:15 | rue | dbussink: I have ran into most, probably |
| 11:46:24 | rue | dbussink: What did you find? |
| 11:46:36 | dbussink | rue: http://pastie.org/237059 |
| 11:46:43 | dbussink | i found it when i was working on some datamapper stuff |
| 11:47:07 | dbussink | look at the weird intermingling between two method calls |
| 11:47:09 | rue | joachimm_: danlucraft_ |
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| 11:56:48 | dbussink | rue: any ideas what could be wrong there? |
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| 14:20:13 | rue | dbussink: Sorry, family stuff. Have you ascertained this is not a framework issue? |
| 14:20:27 | dbussink | rue: pretty much |
| 14:20:38 | dbussink | but the code flow doesn't make any sense |
| 14:21:17 | rue | It seems that something jumps the execution to another retrieve |
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| 14:21:32 | rue | Unless it is threading it |
| 14:21:38 | dbussink | nope, it's not threaded |
| 14:21:43 | dbussink | was my first guess but i checked |
| 14:22:05 | dbussink | i also outputted caller to debug |
| 14:22:11 | dbussink | that didn't make any sense either |
| 14:22:21 | dbussink | was a line in it that seemed to come out of nowhere |
| 14:23:55 | rue | Could it be the resource.new_record? somehow generating incorrectly? |
| 14:24:04 | rue | Also, is stdout synched? |
| 14:24:29 | dbussink | should be, i started digging in because i got a nil back where i didn't expect it |
| 14:24:35 | dbussink | and this shows where it comes from |
| 14:24:54 | dbussink | the resource.new_record? does nothing more besides accessing a ivar in resource |
| 14:25:10 | rue | Presumably |
| 14:25:33 | rue | Stick a .caller in after printing the ivar name |
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| 14:27:17 | rue | I am not seeing the lower caller output at all unless you are trimming it |
| 14:28:26 | dbussink | http://pastie.org/237373 |
| 14:28:35 | dbussink | that's with caller |
| 14:28:40 | dbussink | and Thread.current |
| 14:29:55 | dbussink | there caller seems normal |
| 14:30:49 | dbussink | rue: http://pastie.org/237375 |
| 14:31:12 | rue | "new_record" |
| 14:31:48 | dbussink | that's inside the new_record call |
| 14:31:58 | dbussink | so it goes wrong there |
| 14:32:07 | dbussink | but i don't have a clue what goes wrong there |
| 14:32:21 | dbussink | !defined?(@new_record) || @new_record |
| 14:32:26 | dbussink | that's what that method does |
| 14:32:31 | dbussink | maybe it's the define |
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| 14:36:19 | dbussink | if i change it so it doesn't use defined? it's still broken |
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| 14:39:00 | rue | It should not be going through a generated method for the new_record at all though, should it? |
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| 14:40:32 | dbussink | rue: what do you mean? |
| 14:40:35 | dbussink | in the caller trace? |
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| 14:43:50 | rue | I would imagine it is an actual instance var of the class, so why is it #getting it? |
| 14:44:20 | dbussink | where do you see it's getting it then? |
| 14:44:40 | dbussink | the new_record? call goes fine the first times |
| 14:50:27 | dbussink | rue: if you look at the first pastie: http://pastie.org/237059 |
| 14:50:47 | dbussink | if i change the order of arguments in that excerpt it goes wrong on another one |
| 14:50:55 | dbussink | always seems to fail on the second one |
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| 14:51:39 | dbussink | if i swap person and card, i get an object in my db without a card id, otherwise one without a person id |
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| 15:34:39 | rue | dbussink: I might have a chance to look at it tonight. I would say it is almost definitely a fw issue though |
| 15:35:26 | dbussink | rue: fw? |
| 15:35:32 | dbussink | but i have to go now myself too |
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| 20:22:48 | ssmoot | is there a blog-post or ML something I can catch up on Rubinius with regarding performance, release schedule, etc? |
| 20:29:30 | headius | not really |
| 20:29:39 | headius | what do you want to know? |
| 20:30:07 | headius | I think most perf/release decisions are in flux right now what with the new VM still in development |
| 20:31:00 | tarcieri | yeah, the cpp branch seems to have a number of promising performance optimizations |
| 20:31:02 | tarcieri | like llvm :) |
| 20:32:02 | headius | ssmoot: most folks in here have been saying it's going to be quite a while though |
| 20:32:13 | headius | new VM doesn't really run anything other than basic math expressions right now |
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| 20:32:49 | ssmoot | headius: ah, thanks, switchin' tabs just saw your comments. :) |
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| 20:33:31 | headius | llvm certainly should help in-method execution speed though...eliminates some of the bytecode engine's overhead |
| 20:33:42 | headius | not sure if it helps dynamic invocation much though |
| 20:33:54 | tarcieri | LLVM can make C extensions + MVM quasi-sane |
| 20:33:59 | tarcieri | that's what I want |
| 20:34:01 | ssmoot | headius: Well, for a long while I've been looking forward to pair DM with some lower-level VM specific optimizations. I just don't have any real feel for when Rubinius might be usable for such an effort. |
| 20:34:24 | tarcieri | I was playing around with MVMongrel yesterday and uhh, yeah, crash |
| 20:34:36 | tarcieri | I need to resurrect my Mongrel parser, at least for now |
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| 20:34:56 | headius | tarcieri: how much dependency on rubinius is there in that? I'd love to try it on JRuby |
| 20:35:01 | headius | ssmoot: DM? |
| 20:35:23 | ssmoot | headius: sorry, I get tired of typing it out. ;) DataMapper. |
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| 20:35:44 | tarcieri | headius: I can use the normal Ruby output for Ragel |
| 20:35:59 | tarcieri | headius: the Ruby Ragel outputs can be described as nothing less than horrid though |
| 20:36:36 | headius | ssmoot: ahh right...we'll I'd suggest trying JRuby in the interim, but DM isn't quite there yet |
| 20:36:39 | tarcieri | headius: do you have something like Rubinius.asm in JRuby for building JVM bytecode? |
| 20:36:45 | ssmoot | headius: things like faster collections and predefined ivar slots interested me a lot... |
| 20:37:36 | headius | tarcieri: no, not really, since jruby generally doesn't expose low-level optz like generating bytecode directly |
| 20:37:43 | headius | what would it be needed for? |
| 20:37:52 | tarcieri | headius: goto |
| 20:38:11 | ssmoot | headius: ouch. I'm trying. ;) I tend to work scratching my own itches first, but I've been letting DM cruise on auto-pilot mostly for the last couple months. Soon enough I'll get to dedicate some more time to it. |
| 20:38:45 | headius | tarcieri: it wouldn't be hard to add a compiler plugin to give you goto, but obviously not portable |
| 20:38:49 | headius | label :foo |
| 20:38:51 | headius | ... |
| 20:38:52 | headius | goto :foo |
| 20:39:01 | tarcieri | headius: heh, well, then you'd need to modify Ragel |
| 20:39:30 | headius | why wouldn't you just use the mongrel-java ragel parser? |
| 20:39:41 | tarcieri | oh yeah, good point |
| 20:39:41 | tarcieri | heh |
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| 20:39:49 | tarcieri | that was my first answer the last time you asked me this |
| 20:39:51 | tarcieri | I just forgot |
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| 20:39:52 | tarcieri | heh |
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| 20:42:42 | headius | :) |
| 20:42:57 | headius | I'm surpised the ragel parser generator for ruby is rbx-specific |
| 20:43:00 | headius | that seems like a really odd move |
| 20:43:22 | tarcieri | headius: Ragel supported a backend for outputting a goto-driven FSM using Ruby.asm |
| 20:43:30 | tarcieri | and evan submitted patches to get it working with Rubinius.asm |
| 20:43:38 | headius | what's Ruby.asm |
| 20:43:50 | tarcieri | was Rubinius's precursor to Rubinius.asm I guess |
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| 20:44:34 | headius | ahh |
| 20:44:48 | headius | well, a JRuby version would essentially use JVM goto |
| 20:44:55 | tarcieri | yeah |
| 20:45:16 | tarcieri | I can only assume the Java that Ragel produces is substantially better than the Ruby it produces |
| 20:45:17 | headius | it would require that it always be compiled though |
| 20:45:35 | headius | JRuby doesn't immediately compile the ruby code |
| 20:45:40 | tarcieri | yeah, that's what's nice about the Rubinius.asm approach |
| 20:46:17 | headius | not sure I follow |
| 20:46:54 | headius | I just meant using such an extension would require we compile that method internally before executing it...it wouldn't be a manual step |
| 20:47:15 | headius | __COMPILE__ = true as a pragma or something |
| 20:47:53 | headius | jruby user never needs to do anything for a method to get compiled other than call it a lot |
| 20:48:00 | tarcieri | headius: Rubinius.asm reminds me a lot of what I'm doing in Reia... the toplevel scope can be evaluated, but when you execute the blocks it invokes the compiler |
| 20:48:12 | tarcieri | sort of halfway between evaluated and compiled |
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| 20:48:36 | headius | sure, I've played with that in jruby's compiler too, and in duby |
| 20:48:54 | headius | if we got our rubinius bytecode engine up to date we could easily add Rubinius.asm support as well |
| 20:48:56 | tarcieri | nice |
| 20:49:02 | headius | it's pretty out of date right now |
| 20:49:10 | rue | ssmoot: Incidentally, dbussink noticed an issue that may be from DM http://pastie.org/237059 |
| 20:50:26 | headius | hmmm, I wonder if it runs anything rightnow |
| 20:51:05 | ssmoot | rue: not really sure what I'm looking at here? Have an example of the failing code? |
| 20:51:20 | headius | test.rbc:1:in `const_missing': uninitialized constant RBIX (NameError) |
| 20:51:37 | headius | what's that? must be some constant rbx stuffs into the compiled output now? |
| 20:51:52 | headius | are rbc still ruby marshal format? |
| 20:53:07 | headius | that's the error I get loading .rbc into jruby |
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| 20:55:55 | dbussink | ssmoot|brb: it's an excerpt from some code i have |
| 20:55:57 | dbussink | and a snippet from dm code |
| 20:56:02 | dbussink | which behaves really really weird |
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| 20:59:47 | Defiler | headius: RBIX is the label/header/begin stamp |
| 21:00:02 | Defiler | headius: Our rbc format is now short header + sha1 and then the marshal data |
| 21:00:03 | Defiler | I believe |
| 21:00:09 | Defiler | So you will want to skip the first 24 bytes |
| 21:00:13 | headius | mmm ok, I'll try that |
| 21:00:29 | Defiler | I believe it is 4 for 'RBIX' and then 20 for an SHA1 signature |
| 21:00:40 | headius | I don't know how much bytecode has changed since this was written a year ago though...maybe a lot? |
| 21:00:50 | Defiler | I don't think so, no |
| 21:01:02 | Defiler | We have new instructions and whatnot, but the format hasn't changed recently that I am aware |
| 21:01:07 | headius | well maybe I'll spend today fiddling with it |
| 21:01:21 | headius | hasn't had any love in a long time |
| 21:01:28 | headius | would be kinda cool to run .rbc |
| 21:01:33 | headius | (again) |
| 21:01:41 | Defiler | cool |
| 21:01:58 | Defiler | That would be handy for everybody, I think |
| 21:02:05 | Defiler | more proof of correctness for everything |
| 21:02:27 | chop3 leaves the room. | |
| 21:02:56 | headius | sure, and if we could get that engine faster than interpreter it could be a standard way to run in jruby |
| 21:03:04 | headius | that would be hard though |
| 21:03:13 | pth leaves the room. | |
| 21:04:02 | Defiler | having a bunch of VMs running the same Ruby kernel is my dream |
| 21:04:05 | Defiler | So I wish you luck |
| 21:05:18 | headius | well we could run the kernel without rbc support |
| 21:05:28 | headius | just need to add rbx primitives and whatnot |
| 21:05:54 | Defiler | Yeah, I was, as is my wont, slightly changing the subject to aid confusion |
| 21:06:03 | headius | good on ya |
| 21:06:34 | headius | hmm, I need to look up header code |
| 21:06:46 | headius | just chopping off 24 isn't doing it, it wants version next and it's coming out wrong |
| 21:07:41 | rue | Look over the marshal code, it is pretty short |
| 21:07:53 | headius | that doesn't seem to have the header |
| 21:08:08 | headius | not on cxx branch anyway |
| 21:08:18 | headius | I'm looking at compiled_file method "encode_to" |
| 21:08:48 | headius | hmmm |
| 21:08:48 | trythil enters the room. | |
| 21:08:58 | headius | am I reading this right? looks like they're just newline-separated strings |
| 21:09:00 | dbussink | rue: did you have a suggestion where i could look? |
| 21:09:52 | Defiler | headius: cpu_marshal.c |
| 21:10:07 | headius | .c? for shame |
| 21:10:10 | Defiler | but hell, maybe that is obsolete |
| 21:10:18 | dbussink | the bytecode is different in the cpp branch |
| 21:10:22 | dbussink | it's human readable there |
| 21:10:22 | trythil leaves the room. | |
| 21:10:24 | rue | headius: http://git.rubini.us/?p=code;a=blob;f=shotgun/lib/cpu_marshal.c;h=2a643f2fc970959395c05ca458810b81 7e9f4e3f;hb=HEAD#l533 |
| 21:10:32 | headius | I guess that bit's been ported to rb for cpp branch |
| 21:10:35 | headius | yes? |
| 21:10:45 | Defiler | aah, didn't notice you were on the cpp branch. |
| 21:10:50 | Defiler | but yeah, that is in Ruby now |
| 21:11:30 | headius | I'm on both |
| 21:11:33 | headius | confusing myself |
| 21:11:58 | rue | dbussink: No, I think ssmoot will have a far better idea :) I have never used DM. I was saying that I do _not_ think it is a Ruby problem, but somewhere in the lib |
| 21:12:17 | dbussink | ah, why don't you think it is? |
| 21:12:25 | dbussink | because i can't seem to find a reason for it |
| 21:12:54 | headius | looks like RBIX then 4 bytes for version then 20 bytes for digest |
| 21:13:01 | headius | then code? |
| 21:13:13 | headius | what's int2be |
| 21:13:20 | Defiler | That is what it is in shotgun, at least |
| 21:13:24 | headius | nevermind, I see it |
| 21:13:29 | Defiler | looks like cpp has a new format. didn't know that whoops |
| 21:13:43 | headius | I'm running a non cpp rbc at the moment |
| 21:13:52 | headius | frustrating that it's changing again though |
| 21:13:56 | rue | headius: Big-endian |
| 21:14:48 | headius | is this a signed or unsigned in |
| 21:14:50 | headius | t |
| 21:14:55 | headius | signed, nevermind |
| 21:15:00 | headius | note to self, think first |
| 21:15:13 | headius | er. |
| 21:15:15 | headius | yeah, uint. |
| 21:15:18 | headius | I'll shut up now |
| 21:15:40 | Defiler | You have to hurry up and support the new format so we can change it again |
| 21:15:41 | Defiler | duh |
| 21:15:49 | headius | it must be that time of year |
| 21:15:58 | rue | We can make it middle-endian next! |
| 21:16:13 | headius | one little, two little... |
| 21:16:38 | dbussink | well, cpp is the future format :P |
| 21:16:45 | dbussink | until evan changes that of course ;) |
| 21:16:57 | Defiler | "new legacy" |
| 21:17:56 | headius | header juggling won't be a big deal |
| 21:18:07 | headius | would be nice to settle it though, since there's no way to know which format to use |
| 21:18:18 | headius | at least make version be in the same place |
| 21:18:33 | Defiler | clearly it needs work, yeah |
| 21:18:49 | Defiler | nothing in the cpp branch is 'final', so feel free to make suggestions |
| 21:19:12 | headius | weird, version seems to be coming out as some really high number |
| 21:19:28 | headius | like Exception in thread "main" java.lang.RuntimeException: Can't run Rubinius code with version 75322343 |
| 21:21:13 | gnufied enters the room. | |
| 21:22:06 | headius | btw wmeissner has been working on getting ffi in JRuby proper |
| 21:22:32 | headius | so we probably won't release as a gem...it will just "be there" in jruby.next |
| 21:24:19 | aotearoa enters the room. | |
| 21:24:46 | headius | blast, the marshalled tags all changed |
| 21:25:14 | binary42 enters the room. | |
| 21:25:41 | headius | yeah, there's a lot of changes |
| 21:25:43 | headius | hmm |
| 21:26:18 | headius | sendsite is in the marshal format now? |
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| 21:29:35 | rue | Oh yeah, when we said "it has not changed much" we meant it is still binary |
| 21:31:05 | headius | apparently :) |
| 21:31:13 | headius | though it's less binary than before |
| 21:31:25 | headius | like most literals are marshalled out as strings |
| 21:33:01 | headius | hmm |
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| 21:34:05 | headius | I should probably go with cpp format |
| 21:35:07 | Arjen_ enters the room. | |
| 21:35:24 | headius | or...blast |
| 21:35:27 | headius | screw it |
| 21:35:35 | headius | cpp format is probably going to keep changing |
| 21:35:42 | headius | and the old format is already obsolete |
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| 21:40:06 | headius | unfortunate |
| 21:43:50 | headius | guess I'll play with YARV engine today :( |
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